tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post8543085481924235259..comments2024-03-29T02:07:13.583+00:00Comments on Geoff's Shorts: Discovering the Discovery InstituteAnonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10548882212024368758noreply@blogger.comBlogger27125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-44782178028009261492017-07-31T13:31:58.923+01:002017-07-31T13:31:58.923+01:00Mary Street Sports Physiotherapy and Rehabilitatio...Mary Street Sports Physiotherapy and Rehabilitation Center has a pleased history of giving help to those misery from joint agony and handicap. Regardless of whether it is from damage, surgery, maturing or simply the worry of everyday exercises, we are close by to diminish your side effects and help with your recuperation<br /><a href="http://www.marystphysiotherapy.com" rel="nofollow"> physiotherapist Auburn </a><br /><a href="http://www.marystphysiotherapy.com" rel="nofollow"> physiotherapy Auburn </a><br /><a href="http://www.marystphysiotherapy.com" rel="nofollow"> sports Injury Treatments Auburn </a><br /><a href="http://www.marystphysiotherapy.com" rel="nofollow"> back and neck pain Auburn </a><br /><a href="http://www.marystphysiotherapy.com" rel="nofollow"> muscle Imbalances Auburn </a><br /><a href="http://www.marystphysiotherapy.com" rel="nofollow"> bio mechanical Assessment Auburn </a><br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09976907792701401023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-88546967610061452112012-10-15T21:18:30.308+01:002012-10-15T21:18:30.308+01:00WAY too much time on your hands.
Those who spend ...<i>WAY too much time on your hands.</i><br /><br />Those who spend their time commenting on blogs find themselves on shaky ground when they choose to criticise those who invest their time writing blogs. Anyway, as I've explained before, pulling Twitter metrics is <a href="http://geoffsshorts.blogspot.ie/2012/09/pulling-twitter-metrics.html" rel="nofollow">not a time-consuming process</a> for me.<br /><br /><i>I wonder what nonsense we'd find if we did this for "science" organizations like National Center for Science Education, AAAS, Scientific American, or the like.</i><br /><br />Go knock yourself out. Alternatively, put in the research and prove your unsupported hypothesis. I realise this is not a popular approach in your circles. Be a maverick.<br /><br /><i>Just because a scientific theory has theological implications...</i><br /><br />Whoops! You're supposed to pretend Intelligent Design doesn't say anything about the creators. Care to try again?Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-24431229889470587582012-10-15T19:59:32.893+01:002012-10-15T19:59:32.893+01:00WAY too much time on your hands. I wonder what non...WAY too much time on your hands. I wonder what nonsense we'd find if we did this for "science" organizations like National Center for Science Education, AAAS, Scientific American, or the like. Just because a scientific theory has theological implications doesn't mean it's any less of a theory than another. Get a life!Globe Trotternoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-77468519385734743392012-10-14T22:22:26.195+01:002012-10-14T22:22:26.195+01:00Can you do Creationist and pretend astrophysicist ...Can you do Creationist and pretend astrophysicist Hugh Ross?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-19154895141247089042012-10-06T10:13:26.362+01:002012-10-06T10:13:26.362+01:00Hi Hargaden, (should we switch to first names? I&#...Hi Hargaden, (should we switch to first names? I'm sure most have spotted you on my blog roll by now)<br /><br />Out of curiosity I checked Eric Metaxas' latest tweet. It reads:<br /><br />"<a href="https://twitter.com/ericmetaxas/status/254370054815248385" rel="nofollow">If you know of a big church interested in having me speak about Bonhoeffer, we're putting together a Feb tour...</a>"<br /><br />Following the link in his tweet, we see the criteria he requires for hosting his talk:<br /><br />"Believe strongly in the message and willing to pray and promote strongly throughout your city.<br />Church facility that seats at least 1500.<br />Willingness to share this message to both believers in your city as well as non-believers."<br /><br />I don't feel your attempts to paint him as not being primarily involved in Christian apologetics is a particularly honourable debate tactic. We're burning a lot of electrons on it, and frankly I don't feel Dr Armstrong would warm to the comparison you offer.<br /><br />What do you want me to do? Scrub out "Christian Apologetics" and in its stead write "man devoted to spreading the message of Christianity through books, talks, group planting and other methods"?<br /><br />Does that really weaken my point?<br /><br /><i>"The problem with your daintily laid out counter-argument is once again, you are positing science as one thing that we are adherents to and religion as another. <br /><br />This is not the case and your own rhetoric relies on the fact that science is not something we adhere to."</i><br /><br />Let me try an analogy. There's an astrophysicist called <a href="https://twitter.com/DrBrianMay" rel="nofollow">Dr Brian May</a> who has 2,233 fans on Twitter. That he has so many fans suggests his astrophysics is well viewed. However, if I analyse his followers I may discover a preponderance of folk who also follow Roger Taylor, Queen, Paul Rogers and other 80's rock stars. I could then conclude that people primarily follow him as lead guitarist for Queen, not as astrophysicist.<br /><br />This does not require me to posit that guitar riffs and big hair are incompatible with science. No one would demand that I write a twenty page essay justifying my thoughts that John Deacon is a musician. It does not follow, nor does it imply, that 80's music is a negative force in the world. It just states that the popularity of Dr May is primarily based on music, not science.<br /><br />(Side note - I have not analysed Dr May's twitter followers, nor have I read his academic work. I mean no disrespect to the man.)<br /><br />Is this how my post reads?<br /><br /><i>As a reader, I much prefer the blogposts that involve you writing.</i><br /><br />I appreciate the feedback. And the comments, really. I am like a kid with a new toy as I learn more about Twitter. While I'll likely continue using my <a href="http://geoffsshorts.blogspot.ie/2012/09/pulling-twitter-metrics.html" rel="nofollow">sonic screwdriver</a> in future, I will gradually add in some opinion pieces.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-73719031083176390662012-10-06T09:39:25.709+01:002012-10-06T09:39:25.709+01:00Jonny, great comment, good summary of what I'd...Jonny, great comment, good summary of what I'd hope to achieve.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-86579024413438106272012-10-06T09:37:49.062+01:002012-10-06T09:37:49.062+01:00Hi Doulos,
Sure thing - what did you have in mind...Hi Doulos,<br /><br />Sure thing - what did you have in mind? Expanding the top 25 groups also followed, or something else?<br /><br />Rather than me categorise each one I'll write a script to pull their Twitter biography. Might take me a day or two to get to it.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-76758982543415443552012-10-06T05:13:29.047+01:002012-10-06T05:13:29.047+01:00Could you post more of your data? I am curious at...Could you post more of your data? I am curious at the rest of the results. I did not follow the Discovery Institute until tonight, but I follow at least 8 of those in the group. Doulos1066https://www.blogger.com/profile/03643226640280471658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-12576309181426543232012-10-05T20:36:14.116+01:002012-10-05T20:36:14.116+01:00When time allows I'll comment more fully, but ...When time allows I'll comment more fully, but allow me to reiterate that I have not proposed a conflict between science and religion.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-82174359140217593342012-10-05T19:11:22.135+01:002012-10-05T19:11:22.135+01:00" You are not saying that the people in the ‘..." You are not saying that the people in the ‘also followed’ list have nothing else about them other than their Christianity, you are just highlighting this aspect in relation to your hypothesis that Discovery Institute is religious / socio-religious / socio-political rather than, scientific."<br /><br />But this continues the presupposition that there is an inherent conflict between religious belief and science. Religion and science don't ask the same questions, which is why Creationists are shit scientists and Dawkins is a shit philosopher. There is no conflict, only perceived conflict. the chip monkhttp://nothingleftforcaesar.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-33042618644194560552012-10-05T15:57:28.903+01:002012-10-05T15:57:28.903+01:00I guess there’s a question as to whether one can d...I guess there’s a question as to whether one can draw any inferences from the followers of a particular twitter feed. Specifically in regards to other feeds they follow.<br /><br />I’d say, yes, to a point. I think if a large chunk of the followers of X, also follow , BNP & National Front etc you could make an educated guess about the political leanings of X. <br /><br />I’m not sure that definitions of the word ‘apologist’ are pertinent. You are simply presenting facts and saying it might be interesting. You are not saying that the people in the ‘also followed’ list have nothing else about them other than their Christianity, you are just highlighting this aspect in relation to your hypothesis that Discovery Institute is religious / socio-religious / socio-political rather than, scientific.<br /><br />thats what i take from it anyway.Jonnyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01906663976170128392noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-90094394209689415142012-10-04T08:06:44.573+01:002012-10-04T08:06:44.573+01:00Hi Anonymous,
No real link with Art Robinson. My ...Hi Anonymous,<br /><br />No real link with Art Robinson. My report only displays if more than ten followers of @DiscoveryCSC also follow the account in question, and can't do protected accounts, but otherwise it's fairly complete - they don't seem to like the chap.<br /><br />Hi SPARC,<br /><br />I redid the word cloud, but ran it through some regular expressions first to get title case. I'm a pedant :)Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-72104732258862125812012-10-04T08:05:03.182+01:002012-10-04T08:05:03.182+01:00And just a point: your supporting argument offers ...And just a point: your supporting argument offers the same kind of blunt analysis as the rest of the blogpost. <br /><br />The religion of your parents is the best indicator of the sociological religious identification of any given individual. <br /><br />Your post is about the owned religious activity of people and that cannot be read off a page from some social scientific theory. I realise you don't intend to give a mis-impression but the way you have written, people who take your word on things (which is generally a wise thing to do) would believe you were sharing some useful heuristic. hargadenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08857436673878143466noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-15171770850180129312012-10-04T08:02:08.603+01:002012-10-04T08:02:08.603+01:00Hey Joe. Ask Geoff. I'm Ireland's greatest...Hey Joe. Ask Geoff. I'm Ireland's greatest apologist!<br /><br />Seriously, I used to be a full time evangelist. I'm now a fulltime theology student. So, dude, I know things.<br /><br />Like, I know your description of science is faulty, your definition of religion is preposterous and your understanding of YHWH is catastrophic.<br /><br />You've also reminded me why I don't comment on blogs unless they're about Man City, the importance of civil conduct (especially online) or how my faith makes me allergic to reason.<br /><br />Geoff, apologetics is, as you know, a reasoned defence of faith. I am not doubting that Eric has at times offered, privately or publicly, a reasoned defence of faith. 1 Peter 3:15 says it is the responsibility of all Christians to do so. <br /><br />However, my drinking buddy Robert is an evangelical Christians. He is also a fellow of Dublin University, Trinity College and a renowned historian. If you engage him over a pint on the wonderfully entertaining waffle in Chris Hitchens' yellow book, he will offer you apologetics. You could ask him to come speak to your society about the imaginative world of English speaking 17th Century Puritans and he'll be doing apologetics (if we define Metaxas' Bonhoeffer, for which he won the prize you cite as apologetics)(and better history, probably). <br /><br />My point is that you are warping your results to fit your biases. You have not in any way addressed that point.<br /><br />The problem with your daintily laid out counter-argument is once again, you are positing science as one thing that we are adherents to and religion as another. <br /><br />This is not the case and your own rhetoric relies on the fact that science is not something we adhere to. It is a description of reality that really doesn't need our buy in. Cue: gravity denying will kill you etc. <br /><br />The "science" that is not adhered to by the IDers is in fact politics. Your recent blogposts have demonstrated how a scientifically grounded worldview - to quote our Navy friend Joe - "trial and error, proving things, shit like that" - always spills over into the actual ethical life lived. Presumably support for abortion is not a scientifically informed position? <br /><br />So in conclusion, your counter arguments don't even addressed the suggestion I am making. You know me. I wouldn't bother commenting on the writings of someone who posited some Ditchkinsesque science -v- religion scenario. But the intellectually viable way of describing those relationships requires a recognition that they are not approached in similar ways, they don't make similar demands and fundamentally, they can't be approached alone. <br /><br />The polis can never be ignored. <br /><br />PS: As a reader, I much prefer the blogposts that involve you writing. hargadenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08857436673878143466noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-10930972610572254302012-10-04T07:22:17.410+01:002012-10-04T07:22:17.410+01:00Me: "One's country of birth is the strong...<i>Me: "One's country of birth is the strongest indicator of one's religious views, whereas science finds borders so much more permeable."<br /><br />You: "This sentence appears to compare the adherence and practice of a religion to some free-floating global entity called "science". You'll need to help me out because my exposure to two entities I thought were called "religion" and "science" led me to believe they weren't opposed to each other. Is my understanding wrong?"</i><br /><br />Let's go through my premises:<br /><br /><b>Argument 1</b><br />Science exists.<br />Religion exists.<br />One can be a fan of the ID movement for either religious reasons, scientific reasons, or a blend of both.<br />Analysis of accounts also followed by Twitter fans of the Discovery Institute, coupled with analysis of how those fans choose to describe themselves in their Twitter profiles, indicates that fans of the Discovery Institute overwhelmingly follow it for religious reasons.<br /><br /><b>Supporting argument</b><br />The single most likely indicator of one's religion is the religion of one's parents. By extension, the religious views of one's country can often (but not always) suggest one's religious beliefs.<br />This is not observed in science.<br />Analysis of the countries of origin of Discovery Institute fans indicates that it is popular almost exclusively in areas where American Evangelical Christianity with an antipathy to evolution exists.<br /><br />The compatibility of religion and science (or lack thereof) is not a premise. Having a Theological commitment to opposing evolution does hamper one's ability to do good science, but as I said in the post, this is bad Theology. You're asking me to defend an argument I didn't make.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-44295772204251091122012-10-04T07:21:27.804+01:002012-10-04T07:21:27.804+01:00Hi Hargaden,
Thanks for the comment.
"why h...Hi Hargaden,<br /><br />Thanks for the comment.<br /><br /><i>"why have you described Eric Metaxas as a Christian apologist when he is a historian"?</i><br /><br />Rolling back momentarily, I'd like to investigate the possibility that we're using the term apologetics differently. I read it as meaning encouraging an advancement in understanding of the (Christian) faith, putting forward arguments in favour, countering arguments against and so forth. Is this how you use the term?<br /><br />Looking at Eric Metaxas, he's won the Evangelical Christian Publisher's Association's book of the year. He was a keynote speaker at the National Prayer Breakfast in 2012. He was heavily involved in the <a href="http://www.breakpoint.org/wilberforce-weekend-2012" rel="nofollow">Wilberforce Weekend</a>. He founded <a href="http://socratesinthecity.com/" rel="nofollow">Socrates in the City</a>. He's written about the need for <a href="http://www.qideas.org/essays/cultural-elites-the-next-unreached-people-group.aspx" rel="nofollow">Christians to speak up and influence society</a>.<br /><br />Note - this is not a complaint and I do not object to his activities. I suspect I'd quite enjoy Socrates in the City, but it rather fits in to my understanding of the term apologetics. If I've erred in my use of the term, do let me know and suggest an alternative - I'm quite convinced your understanding is more strongly grounded than mine.<br /><br />On the historical side, he's written a biography of Bonhoeffer which has been described as <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Metaxas" rel="nofollow">"unhistorical, theologically weak, and philosophically naive"</a> and "an appeal to Evangelical Christians in the United States" by Bonhoeffer scholars.<br /><br />He also wrote a book on Wilberforce, but considering his prodigious output these two tomes are hardly career defining.<br /><br /><i>"You have described Mark Driscoll as an apologist"</i><br /><br />Yes, we've both been interviewed on the same apologetics radio show. (Different episodes.) Now, obviously, I'm not the world's foremost Christian apologist, but he's involved in <a href="http://theresurgence.com/pages/about-us" rel="nofollow">the resurgence</a>, which provides training and material to evangelists, and his aim is to make lots of Christian converts through his writing, preaching and media appearances. Again, if I'm not using the word apologetics correctly here, I'm grateful for an alternative.<br /><br />Rick Warren grew his congregation from 200 to 20,000 over three decades. <a href="http://www.saddleback.com/resources/apologetics/" rel="nofollow">This</a> is their apologetics section.<br /><br />Christianity today's mission statement reads "creating Christian content that changes the people who change the world."<br /><br />Desiring God says that <a href="http://www.desiringgod.org/about" rel="nofollow">"Everything we do aims to spread a passion for the supremacy of God in all things for the joy of all peoples through Jesus Christ."</a><br /><br />You could make an argument that the last two should be categorised as Christian news and Christian evangelism. If you like I'm happy to relabel them as such. But would it really change the point I'm making? You cannot argue that any of the top 25 accounts also followed by Discovery Institute fans are about science.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-54295581237977429732012-10-03T22:18:35.557+01:002012-10-03T22:18:35.557+01:00dude, hargaden. Do you have any idea what an apol...dude, hargaden. Do you have any idea what an apologist is?<br /><br />"Is my understanding wrong?"<br />Yes it is. The fundamental practices of science(trial and error, proving things, shit like that) stay the same no matter where it is practiced...religion however varies completely depending on where you live/raised. Because for some reason the Jewish God only loved the Jews and hated all the other little nomadic tribes.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06534340762086118064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-33981960349638102722012-10-03T16:37:22.947+01:002012-10-03T16:37:22.947+01:00I am no supporter of the Discovery Institute, ID o...I am no supporter of the Discovery Institute, ID or any of this stuff but if I read this post from some random selection on the internet I would assume that the author was very ignorant about American evangelicalism. <br /><br />I know that isn't true and so why have you described Eric Metaxas as a Christian apologist when he is a historian. <br /><br />You have described Mark Driscoll as an apologist when he is a church planter with a congregation of over 10,000 in a city that is commonly described as "the most secular in America" whatever the hell that means. <br /><br />You have described Rick Warren as an apologist when he is the pastor of arguably the most influential congregation in the English-speaking world. <br /><br />I read Christianity Today religiously (HAR HAR) because it is a superb periodical. I rate its journalism as consistently on a par with The Atlantic and The New Yorker. It is not an apologetics publication. <br /><br />Desiring God is a fascinating movement based around a church in Minneapolis that has been giving away resources for free over the last few decades that have serious market value. Those resources are primarily the sermons preached by the pastor John Piper and the books that he writes. I again struggle to grasp why you have described this as "apologetics". <br /><br />You'll may think my objections pedantic but they reveal a fundamental flaw in your experiment. You expect to find the data you find and allow complex and nuanced outputs to be warped to fit into the containers you constructed. <br /><br />And that insight, if it is true, casts a fresh light on this sentence at the heart of this post:<br /><br />"One's country of birth is the strongest indicator of one's religious views, whereas science finds borders so much more permeable."<br /><br />This sentence appears to compare the adherence and practice of a religion to some free-floating global entity called "science". You'll need to help me out because my exposure to two entities I thought were called "religion" and "science" led me to believe they weren't opposed to each other. Is my understanding wrong?<br /><br />hargadenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08857436673878143466noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-11128190814031742052012-10-03T15:10:43.497+01:002012-10-03T15:10:43.497+01:00Don't have the data to hand, but I'll chec...Don't have the data to hand, but I'll check it out this evening and comment.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-63217908248518614602012-10-03T14:44:07.882+01:002012-10-03T14:44:07.882+01:00Is there any link with ART ROBINSON, the anti-evol...Is there any link with ART ROBINSON, the anti-evolution, anti-AGW author of the "Oregon Petition"?<br />Art Robinson has some Discovery Institute connections, I know.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-49113148930925141152012-10-03T10:52:33.226+01:002012-10-03T10:52:33.226+01:00Cool, I'll give it a shot post work.Cool, I'll give it a shot post work.Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-84947960703082272382012-10-03T10:33:52.310+01:002012-10-03T10:33:52.310+01:00Nice that I could help you. If you want to prevent...Nice that I could help you. If you want to prevent double entries due to different usage of lower and upper case letters you will find two switches under "language" ("MAKE ALL WORDS UPPER-CASE" and "make all words lower-case", respectively) after wordle generated an initial cloud.SPARChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09563722742249547887noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-70502867913472892162012-10-03T08:28:18.382+01:002012-10-03T08:28:18.382+01:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16964620879837528795noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-82651374640872860172012-10-03T07:16:40.337+01:002012-10-03T07:16:40.337+01:00Thanks John! My next post will be on fake Twitter ...Thanks John! My next post will be on fake Twitter accounts dressed to look up as Christian - and who's buying them. Hope to see you back!Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8028643425691313983.post-85011542682082964492012-10-03T07:08:15.873+01:002012-10-03T07:08:15.873+01:00Legend. Thanks SPARC, I'll do a wordcloud of a...Legend. Thanks SPARC, I'll do a wordcloud of all Twitter profiles, not just the samples I posted.<br /><br />Thanks!Geoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17925999586920385972noreply@blogger.com